Professionalization in Indie & Trad Publishing: An Interview with Jenna Harte

Introduction

Seldom has my life been so different between one year and the next. A few standouts come to mind: the stark difference between October of my seventeenth year and October of my eighteenth were particularly different, given the total upheaval to my life and family in that time. 2019 and 2020 were so very different for so many of us that it barely bears repeating. In September of 2022 I was pregnant and a PhD candidate; by September of 2023, I had my PhD and my first child at home. 

Last year at this time, I was running Penguin Preptober 2024 for my writing group, the former NaNoWriMo South Bay municipal chapter. For many reasons (fit for a post all on its own), we left the organization before it fell apart and found ourselves attempting to make the long and lonely trip to the other side: a place all our own, no support from NaNo central or its resources, and none of its programming. While of course I miss those resources, particularly the website, I am grateful that we intentionally made that journey before we were forced to. Now, in a world entirely without NaNo, our group is at least still afloat with banked programming and materials, mostly made by me, and we have a small core of people continuing to write and working on getting published. 

When we were still finding our feet, however, I was looking around for inspiration and alternatives. What did non-NaNo NaNo look like? Who was doing it? What resources were they creating? Since she was writing a romance last year—and I was working on What Remains, which is also ostensibly romantic—Marissa sent me to Write with Harte… and that’s how my whole life started to change. First off, I took inspiration and direction from Jenna’s worksheets and made many of my own, though of course, because we’re a group that does multiple genres, I made ours much more general. I also made freewrite worksheets, and particularly studied Jenna’s three-act plot structure materials (along with some others) to make that most difficult of worksheets, because I personally use headlight plotting. Her materials and organization were very useful to me, but more than anything, there was a sense of “This lady knows what she’s talking about, with both traditional and indie publishing.” I’m a student at heart, I’m afraid… still very academic. I look for teachers, and for some source of information about doing things the “right” way, or among the available right ways.

This resulted in me being on the mailing list when Jenna put out a call for submissions to Moonlight and Margaritas. I was in a hard place and having a strange moment at this time last year, at home with my toddler in the fall. It was around the time when Dan Olson’s slightly deranged “I Don’t Know James Rolfe” video essay came out. If you haven’t seen it, and you consider yourself as existing somewhere in the realm of artist/writer/content creator/passionate amateur/exhausted journeyman… I highly recommend it. I don’t think it’s exaggerating to say that this video scared me straight. (Not actually straight! Still bi! Look at the nebula!) Dan obsessively explores The Angry Videogaming Nerd, a staple of young Gen X/Xennial/Elder Millennial internet life and what it means to be a backyard artist, an amateur, and a content creator—as opposed to ever professionalizing.

This may be a constant theme for my age cohort, but Dan’s video is an intense and unflinching meditation on impending middle age and the failure to grow up as a professional artist and critic, something so common to the creatives and academics I know, along with the resistance we have to professionalization… and a certain kind of adulthood in general. Watching him realize he doesn’t know James Rolfe, that he doesn’t know Dan Olson, running into the darkness, beard shocked white with realization that he’s not a filmmaker either… something in that void looked like me. 

So my son started preschool. And I started submitting to anthologies. I’m not where I want to be yet, but I can see the path forward… and I’m not just writing hundreds of thousands of words of novels into the void or for a couple beta readers anymore. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with those things; I love passionate amateurism, and I think the world needs more of it. There’s nothing wrong with writing as a hobby. I have never wanted to be a writing hobbyist, however—since I was a kid, I wanted to be an author. To me, an author is something professional, and my journey over the past year has been a steep climb toward a certain level of craft and professionalization. I no longer watch the end of that video essay, hear the sound of that guitar, and feel like I’m falling forever into an abyss, along with all of my words. 

Jenna’s been a huge part of that journey, and it’s an honor to interview her. Without further ado (or mediations on art in middle age), allow me to introduce you to Jenna Harte.

Interview: Jenna Harte

Q: Hi Jenna! Thank you so much for joining us. You have a long and storied history in the world of indy and traditional publishing, straddling both sides (all sides!) with a lot of insight. I know you’re also looking to get more of your own stuff out there and start new projects, and that’s part of what I want to talk to you about. First off, can you please introduce yourself to our readers?

A: I’m Jenna Harte, a die-hard romantic who writes romance and mystery. I never started out to be a writer. I got my start writing fiction through fan fiction. When one of my stories was stolen, twice, I wondered if maybe I had the goods to write original fiction. Truth be told, I didn’t at that time, but I worked at it and wrote Deadly Valentine, which reached the quarter finals of Amazon’s Breakout Author Award in 2013. Later I won a Harlequin pitch contest on Twitter and was asked for the full MS, but it sat there for nearly two years (1 year, 11 months!) at which point I sought an agent. Harlequin was a no, but my agent later sold that book as a three-book series. I was off and running as a romance author! 

Q: Do you mind telling folks a little bit about your various series? What’s your favorite series and couple to write about, for instance?

A: The Valentines were my first series and, I suppose, closest to my heart. I love sexy sleuthing couples (think The Thin Man or Hart to Hart). I’ve published 7 books (the 7th is awaiting re-publishing at the moment) and 2 novellas, and am supposed to be writing book 8, currently referred to as “dead guy in a rowboat.”

But I enjoy my Southern Heat series, which was the one initially sold by my agent. That publisher went out of business, so now I self-publish them and added a fourth book to the series at the behest (demand!) of my sister. I love writing romance, but my agent suggested I try cozy mystery. I love the humor and quirkiness of the Sophie Parker Coupon Mysteries, and have a story idea that will have a similar vibe but be a romance. 

Q: I know you also have a bajillion other projects, and I want to give everyone a chance to hear about them. First of all, do you mind telling folks about Write with Harte? What inspired you to create it and all of its content? What’s the story behind that?

A: I get a great deal of energy and inspiration being around other writers and readers. I love going to events for this reason. During covid, of course, that didn’t happen, so I decided to build a community for romance authors… Write with Harte. I share what I’ve learned over the years, but also trends, news, and other tidbits for romance writers. The first year I started the site, I ran Writevember to coincide with NaNoWriMo, and included a weekly call. It was so fun, we continued the call past the challenge, and that call continues today! 

Q: Awesome. I love the call myself! You also started an anthology series, Tender and Tempting Tales. No one who follows this blog can fail to know about that, since I’m in the first two volumes and I’m now one of your underlings there. ;) Tell us the story of how it came about, how you found the editors for it, etc.

A: In 2024, I attended Creatures, Crimes & Creativity, a multi-genre author event (it’s a blast!), and noted how each time I went, there were free copies of mystery or sci-fi short fiction magazines in my swag bag. I wondered why there weren’t any for romance. I brought this up on a Write with Harte call, and somehow from that idea an anthology was born. I’m one of those people who will jump on a fun idea without much thought. The editors are from Write with Harte and volunteered to be a part of the project (they receive royalties from book sales). 

Q: Good points all! What’s the future of Tender and Tempting Tales? What do you hope to do with it? Where do you hope it goes from here?

A: Well, it’s still new, and we’re finding our feet. We’ll be publishing the second anthology, Midnight, Mischief & Mistletoe, in November. That said, the team has grown (thank you, Tara) and we’ve already planned for two anthologies in 2026.

My personal goals are to create a place for emerging as well as experienced romance writers to publish their work, and to become an anticipated anthology by romance readers. I’d even enjoy using it as a way to help new writers hone their craft. 

Q: Agreed all the way around! You also have a history as an agent, amazingly enough. So you’ve been in just about every role in publishing—agent, writer, publisher. How did you get into being an agent? What did you like and dislike about it? Why did you get out of the biz?

A: This is another, that-sounds-like-fun idea that I jumped into. This time I was at the Maryland Writer’s Association conference (another good one!) speaking on dictating your novel. My agent was also there (we always roomed together if we were going to the same event). During lunch, she started talking about what she was going to do when she retired and how she’d like the agency to continue by taking on agents. During the train ride together home, the topic came up again, and she said she’d like me to join her. Me being me, I said yes. However, being an agent is challenging. The inbox of queries fills fast. I had to close down a lot just to keep from drowning. There’s a ton of reading, which leaves little time for pleasure reading. The most challenging thing is that you don’t get paid until your author does, which in the trad world can be years. What I loved was working with authors. 

My agent unexpectedly passed, and I wasn’t in a place to take over the agency. Her family decided to close it, and while many authors in the agency asked if I could start my own or get work at another agency, I decided I wanted to focus on my own writing. However, all of us who worked with my agent in her agency are still connected and engaged with each other. We weren’t just her clients, we were all friends. 

Q: That’s tragic; I’m so sorry. Thinking happily of her, what would you say is a funny or strange story from your days as an agent?

A: My agent had the funniest ones. I think it’s important to love your story, but I always gave a little eyeroll at the authors who pitched their stories as the greatest, most unique story ever written in the history of the world. 

Q: Lol, I could see that. From an agent’s perspective, what would you tell indy authors online to do? Go for an agent, or go it alone? When in someone’s career is a good moment to seek an agent, do you think?

A: There are so many factors in deciding trad vs indie. It’s important to understand that agents sell to publishers who sell to bookstores (not readers). They tend to have narrower views of what they’ll accept. Agents will only take what they think they can sell to publishers. That means even if an agent loves a submission, they won’t offer to rep it.  

One consideration authors need to make is whether or not their book is within the lanes publishers have, which requires keeping up on publishing trends. But they also need to consider their goals. Trad publishing can take two years or more, authors may or may not get an advance, and may or may not be shelved in a brick-and-mortar bookstore (personally, I’m okay with that because book returns hurt). 

All that makes it sound like indie is the way to go, and if you want quick publishing and all the control, it is, but there are some benefits to trad publishing such as possible advance, professional edit and book packing for free, and there is still clout that goes with saying you’re trad published. 

Many highly successful indie authors are now trad published. Interestingly, publishers are picking up their backlists, and many of these authors are only giving print rights, not ebook or audio. They’re being smart about their money, as royalties are less in trad publishing than indie publishing. 

Q: Thank you; that’s good, nuanced advice. You are also (also also also) a ghostwriter. Some of the folks following this blog are trying to get into professional writing; as you know, it’s a huge and diverse world with a lot of serpentine career paths and options. How did you get into ghostwriting initially? Why did you stick with it?

A: I was an “expert” on About.com (later DotDash), but they were changing things around and I saw the writing on the wall. So I went on the hunt for new freelance work. By this time I was freelancing in non-fiction, but was published in fiction. I saw an ad for romance ghostwriter and thought, why not? (Do you see a pattern here?) I was terrified in some ways because I’m a pantster that gets stuck a lot, and have difficulty plotting. I got the job (through a company) and later, I contracted directly with my client. 

I’ve learned a lot through ghostwriting. For example, my turn-arounds are so fast that the writing isn’t as tight as I’d want for myself, yet readers don’t care. They love the books. I’ve learned to write fast, and while some think this leads to poor writing, like everything else, the more you do something, the better you get. I’ve also had to write things that I worried I’d get wrong like a hero who was an alcoholic actively drinking at the start of the book or another hero with PTSD. My background is in social work, so I worked to pull from that and not on cliches about these serious issues. 

Admittedly, after nearly 7 years, averaging a book a month, I’m tired. I still do it because the income supports all my passion projects… although I’m currently looking at ways to make the income elsewhere such as increasing my book sales or monetizing Write with Harte. 

Q: That makes sense—and yes, you seem very willing to jump into new and exciting things and figure it out. (I’m the same way.) How much do you write a week as a ghostwriter? (I know the answer to this, but it bears repeating!) Do you think that’s a standard amount for ghostwriters who write novels for their clients?

A: I average a 70,000 to 75,000 word book a month. The last week usually requires more writing as I get off pace a lot. But I write an average of 17,000 to 18,000 words a week. An easy day is 2500 to 3500 words. Once I have to write 4000 or more it gets more challenging. 

I can’t speak to everyone who hires ghostwriters. In the fiction arena, romance for sure, clients are looking for steady regular releases, so writing a book every 4 to 6 weeks would be standard. 

Q: What are the challenges of being a ghostwriter? What are the victories and enjoyable challenges?

A: The output is probably the biggest challenge. It takes a lot of mental energy, so if you’re wanting to also write for yourself, it can be hard. For me, when I see readers gush about the work, I’m thrilled and feel validated (I can write stories people love!). At the same time, it’s hard because it’s not my name and I’m not earning the income from the sales. I have a great client who has always been understanding if family issues come up. She often tosses me a bonus, so I feel appreciated. I also like to “brag” that I’ve written over 80 books just for her! (I had two clients at one time…I think I wrote 8 for her.) Q: Oh my goodness, that’s so much! What advice would you give a baby writer who wants to get into ghostwriting? 

A: People who hire ghostwriters want books that fit the market, so you need to understand the genre expectations as well as what’s hot now. You’ll likely be asked to plot too (often you submit the plot for approval before writing. My client has a plotter—for which I’m grateful, as I hate plotting). You may need to write stuff you don’t like. I hate the secret child trope, but my client has built a career on that and secret pregnancy. You need to write consistently with good word output. Dictation can be helpful for this. I have an article about ghostwriting on Write with Harte.

Q: Thank you for that; I was hoping to add the link, and you made life easy for me. What’s a funny or strange story you have from ghostwriting?

A: I suppose the thing I think is interesting is that I’m not the only ghostwriter my client uses for one of her pen names, and yet no one seems to notice. I guess our voices/style are similar. 

Q: Thank you so much. What’s coming up in the world of Jenna Harte? What are your next projects, and what do you hope to achieve next?

A: Thank you for having me! I’ve got a lot of ideas whirling around in my head. Currently, I need to focus on my dead guy in the rowboat mystery, and because it’s been awhile since I’ve written in the Valentine mysteries, I’m looking at a few bonus content bits, probably scene rewrites from alternative POV and/or between-the-books scenes. I also need to republish book 7, Dead but Not Forgotten.

I’m working on a new pen name that I’m excited about. It’s a bit ambitious with a 7-book series that has an overarching plot arc through all books. Plus there’s woo-woo, which I’ve never written, so keeping up on the rules and systems of the world is a challenge. 

I have tons of story ideas that I hope to get to someday, and publishing goals, such as finally getting picked up by Harlequin. 

Of course, I’m still working on the anthology and running Write with Harte. I’m looking at adding a membership aspect and perhaps hosting a virtual summit. 

Lately, I’ve been looking at Substack with the idea of writing about writing and second-half-of-life stuff… sounds fun, right? 

Q: It does! Fun and useful to folks, and I would love to read it. Thank you so much for joining me for this interview; I’m sure it’ll be super helpful for folks reading, especially newer authors wondering what routes to take.

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Thank you, Jenna.

Thanks for reading, and I hope this post has been meaningful, helpful, or inciteful for you. Are you a romance reader? Want to have some fun? Tender and Tempting Tales will be doing a Facebook Takeover with a bunch of the Midnight, Mischief, and Mistletoe authors on November 5th, and it includes a spot with me (1:30 Pacific) and one with Jenna as an author. As staff for T&TT, Jenna and I will also be hosting, and there will be a bunch of great prizes from us and the other authors. Come check it out!

We're also running the Halloween Readers Contest right now, and my spot will be on the 28th. During the 28th, your name will be entered into a drawing and you can win a copy of "All Hands" and the sample edition of the Star Navy Grub Guide from me! All you have to do to enter is join the Tender and Tempting Tales email list. You even get a free story for doing so!

In other news (and I'll talk more about this in coming weeks), I have another Starship Valkyrie story picked up for inclusion in an anthology. This one is a dime-detective anthology called Bourbon and Lead from Raconteur Press, and my story is "Prompt Critical," a science-fiction murder mystery set on a space cruise around Saturn! Bourbon and Lead will be coming out on November 14th, two weeks after Mercs and Mayhem with my story "Power Play," which is coming out on Halloween! I'm really excited about both of these folks. Lots of Valkyrie stories this fall. United and Strong!